Brethren Moderators, Elder West, and Ladies and Gentlemen:

    I am glad to be here this morning for the purpose of giving a reason, Scripturally, for what I believe in my religious profession; what I believe the Scriptures teach, and I believe this proposition, as read in your hearing, dearly expresses the differences between myself and my opponent as to this doctrine.

    I would like to say, before I go into the defining of my proposition, that I do not know Elder West. I never met him before. As for myself, I joined the Primitive Baptist Church in 1914, some twelve or thirteen years after the division between the factions—if that is the proper word to use—that Elder West and I belong to, respectively. I have an idea that Elder West is a much younger man than I, and, also, that he probably joined after the division; however, I would like to say that whether that is the case, or whether it is not the case, I feel that my own individual case is without having been prejudiced through the heated discussion when the division took place.

My proposition, as read, I will now define. The Scriptures teach—and by that is meant that the Scriptures state directly, or teach by implication or by suggestion—that God from the beginning—and we understand what that means—that from the beginning of all creation did absolutely—which means to decree beforehand, or ordain the act of decreeing, which means absolutely unconditional, and when the term "absolute predestination" or "absolutely did predestinate" all things both good and evil, whatsoever comes to pass, that is dear and needs no interpretation, because it says "all things," and that is exactly what we mean. That is exactly what we think the Scriptures teach.  I fully realize there are many places in the Scriptures that "all things" or "all men" means what is under consideration.  But in this proposition, as outlined here, I mean all things and I do not want anyone to misunderstand me. I mean all things.  

Now, I want to give you some of the definitions that Webster gives of the main words in this proposition.

"Predestine: To decree beforehand; to foreordain."

"Predestination: The act of decreeing or foreordaining events; especially, theology, the doctrine that God has from eternity unchangeably appointed or determined whatsoever comes to pass; particularly that He has preordained men to everlasting happiness or misery, and is a part of the unchangeable plan of the Divine Government." In other words, the unchangeable purpose of an unchangeable God.  Thus Webster's direct quotation; "Predetermine, to settle or determine beforehand: to determine to settle in purpose or counsel."

"Foreordain, to ordain or appoint beforehand; to preordain; to predestinate; to predetermine."

"Appoint, to fix, to settle or to establish; to constitute, ordain, or fix, by decree or decision, as to appoint a holiday.  ‘When He appointed the foundation of the earth.'—Proverbs viii. 23. To allot or assign to; to designate by authority, as to appoint a committee; to appoint a guardian; to appoint a time for the meeting; to ordain, command, ,or order. 'Thy servants are ready to do whatsoever my Lord, the king, shall appoint.' -2 Samuel xv. 15. To appoint, to ordain or decree." "The Lord had appointed to defeat the good counsel of Ahithophel." That is just about as hard a word to pronounce as you will find, so you can skip it if you want to. It is 2 Samuel xvii. 14. I believe that explains my definition of the proposition as, outlined.

I want to introduce this proposition by the use of Acts iv. 27 and 28. I believe this Scripture most clearly and most pointedly expresses what I believe this proposition to teach:  "For of a truth against thy holy child Jesus, whom thou hast anointed, both Herod, and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles, and the people of Israel, were gathered together, for to do whatsoever thy hand and thy counsel determined before to be done."  The apostle doesn't only assert just an ordinary assertion. He says, "For of a truth against thy holy child, Jesus, whom thou hast anointed, both Herod, and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles, and the people of Israel, were gathered together, for to do whatsoever thy hand and thy counsel determined before to be done:"

What did they do?  Did they have anything except evil intentions?  Were they trying, longingly, to fulfill that which God had determined?  No. They had no idea of doing that.  

They did not believe in Him and said, "Away with Him, is not meet that He should live upon the earth."  So, I want to say, friends, that the environment that moved all of these wicked men at—this time wherein some of the things, "Whatsoever thy hand and thy counsel before determined to be done."  And while I believe each and every one of them acted under the wicked influences and leadership of the devil, if you please, yet it was what God had before determined to be done, and not only "whatsoever that God had before determined to be done," but also what His hand, if you please, had sponsored to that end. These men could not have been where they were if it had not been for the hand of God. There is nothing that lives without a cause. You cannot lift yourself by your bootstraps.  All of these men, in every breath that they breathed, was by the power of Almighty God.  And yet, their leadership, I will admit, was of the devil, as it was with Judas when he betrayed the Saviour. He said, "He it is to whom I shall give a sop, and He gave it to Judas."  I next want to notice, in connection with this, Acts ii. 23: "Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain." I want you to know that this Scripture emphatically declares that it was according to the determinate counsel of Almighty God.  It is a plain statement of Scripture. You cannot ignore the fact of the importance of the crucifixion of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. He was crucified for His people. He was crucified for their salvation and for their justification.  If it had not been fixed, and determined and settled thus, something might have "wabbled on the gudgeon," and the whole thing uncertain.

So I want to say, my friends, to begin with, that not only this but "all things" else were leading up to the grand and glorious crucifixion, and as wicked and heinous as it was, they meant to destroy Him; to put Him out of the way because they didn't like Him. They didn't know anything that was good concerning Him. Not only that, but after He had performed miracles, after He had healed the sick and restored sight to the blind, and all of these things, their hearts were so hardened, and they still persisted, and said that he had a devil in all of these things. I say, my friends, that He went forth conquering and to conquer, and the reason why Judas and these other people—I mean Herod and Pontius Pilate and all of those fellows did this—the direct reason was their own wills in the matter. The primary reason was because God had ordered it that way. You might say, then, doesn't He punish them for what He orders? Does He punish them for the things that He has commanded? What about Pharaoh? "Thus sayeth the Lord, Let my people go, yet I will harden his heart so that he shall not let them go." The Lord commanded him thus through Moses, saying, "Let my people go," and he refused. Why?  The Lord tells you why he refused. Simply because that He said in the ninth chapter of Romans, "Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew forth my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth."  For that purpose. You can't tell me that God would be disappointed at all. How could God be thwarted in any of His purposes and decrees? I say, my friends, that I am glad that He has never been disappointed. Jesus said, "Behold, I go as determined."—Matt. xxvi. 24.

I next want to call your attention to Romans xiii. I:  "Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers, for there is no power but of God; the powers that be are ordained of God." "There is no power but of God." What can you do against His power? I want to ask you if you, in your puny and weak thinking faculties, had the power to give or retain a dangerous weapon to a criminal—to a bank robber that was seeking to evade the law—if you had the power to give it to him, or if you had the power to take it from him, would you give it to him? No, sir. You wouldn't do that .because you are weak; because you are puny. You wouldn't give him that gun and feel assured that you could accomplish your purpose in capturing him. But yet, brethren and sisters and friends, all power is of God. "The powers that be are ordained of God." If you believe there is any other power except the power of God and the power that is ordained of God you do not believe this Scripture which I have just read in your hearing.

Then, I say, that when all of these evil powers that were brought against our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, what did Jesus say? He said to Pilate, "For this purpose I came into the, world, and to this end was I born." He said, "Knowest thou not that I have the power to release thee and power to crucify thee?" Jesus said, "Thou canst have no power at all against me except it is given thee from above."—John xix. 10, 11. I say, my friends, that in every sense of the word God holds the breath and destiny of every living thing in His hand, and if it were not for that, we would be in a miserably bad fix.

I next want to introduce Daniel ii. 28 and 29: "BUT there is a God in heaven that revealeth secrets, and maketh known to the King Nebuchadnezzar what shall be in the latter days. Thy dream and the visions of thy head upon thy bed are these: as for thee, 0 king, thy thought came into thy mind upon thy bed, what should come to pass hereafter: and He that revealeth secrets maketh known to thee what shall come to pass." I say, my friends, if there were no other Scripture but this one in all of the Book—we find that was a long time before Christ that the Lord took Daniel and told him that He was going to show him what shall be done in the latter days. Was it all good and pleasant and smooth matters that He was going to show him? No, sir. It was by the rise and fall of kingdoms, by the murderous ascension of kings to the throne—blasphemy, murder, and everything which is under consideration. The Lord showed him what shall be in the latter days. What shall be, and not what may or might not be, but what shall be.

I next come to Daniel ii. 45: "Forasmuch as thou sawest that the stone was cut out of the mountain without hands, and that it brake in pieces the iron, the brass, the clay, the silver, and the gold; the great God hath made known to the king what shall come to pass hereafter; and the dream is certain, and the interpretation thereof sure." Do you think, according to the Scriptures, that any of these things could fail to come to pass when the dream is certain and the interpretation thereof is sure? I say that these things are certain.

Just here I want to give my opponent some questions.

1. Did God determine in the counsel of His own will in eternity to make a world, and did He not engage His wisdom to devise the plan and His power to perform it?

2. Was not the wisdom of God abundantly sufficient to devise a plan for a world that would in all its parts, in every way, and at all times and places, meet and perform the demands of His will, and was not His power equally adequate to perform it?

3. Did not God will the existence of, and determine in the counsel of His will to make a world that would turn out in every way as it has, and could He not have made it so that it would have turned out differently if such would have suited His will and purpose better?

4. If it was God's will to have a world into which sin would never come, and yet, He engaged His wisdom and power to make one into which He knew sin would come, did He not knowingly engage His wisdom and power in the making of it so that it would result in the defeat of His own will?

5. Could sin have entered the world unless God had allowed it to enter? And could, not God have prevented its entrance as easily as to allow it? Would it have been best for it not to enter? If so, did God do that which was best when He allowed it to enter?

6. Did not God create all things for Himself? If so, do not all things belong to Him? And if they do, then did He not have the right to determine the exact sphere and position that each thing should occupy in the world?

7. If God created all things for Himself, then did He not have some use for, and some purpose to be fulfilled by each thing that He created? If so, did He not make them in such a way that they would be best suited for and most certain to serve the use and purpose for which he created them? If not, why not?

8. If God has determined to deal with man according to man's conduct and yet has not determined what man's conduct shall be, but has left man free to determine his own course of conduct independent of any influence which God has determined, then does not man determine both his own course and the course of God in all of God's dealings with him?

9. If God's conduct in dealing with man depends upon man's conduct, and yet man in the performance of said conduct does not depend upon God, then is not man more independent than God?

10. When God alone existed in eternity before time began, did not all time with all the events of time of every shade, grade and character depend upon Him as to whether they should  ever exist or not?

11. If time with all of its various and varied events did, back in eternity, depend upon God as to whether they should ever exist or not, then did He purposely arrange for their existence, or did He do it accidentally?

12. If any part of the events of time did not or do not depend on God for existence, then would they not have been just as certain to exist had there been no God as they are?

13. If in eternity before time, time with all the events of time did depend upon God for existence, and yet some of them do not now depend upon Him for existence, will you please tell me when, where, and how, their dependence upon Him for existence ceased?

14. Did God eternalIy foreknow all things? If so, is His foreknowledge like Himself, immutable, and if it is, can any power in heaven, earth, or hell, change His knowledge or deceive Him? If not, can any event of time be changed from the way He knew it would be? If so, how could His foreknowledge stand?   

15. Did God eternally foreknow anything independent of the counsel of His own will? If so, what was it, and upon what was such foreknowledge based?

16. Did God foreknow that this world and all the creatures therein would exist before and independent of His determination to make them? If not, did His foreknowledge of their independence rest on the fact that He had determined to make them?

Time expired.